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Old 12-13-2005, 02:16 PM   #1 (Print)
Man In Black
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Battlestar Galactica

I know BSG is thought of as a really good sci fi show, but which one are they referring to? Are they all good, or just certain series?

I know there was the 1978 original series, and then theres the current series airing on SciFi.

I just got BSG Season 2 and am watching it.

BTW, in episode one of Season 2, right at the beginning, that older woman who is in the brig looks like the actor that plays that woman on one of those soaps, As The World Turns or Guiding Light, I forget which. is it?
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Old 12-13-2005, 02:18 PM   #2 (Print)
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The original BSG series in 1978 was a Star Wars rip-off and complete hooey.

The current series is far superior but much grimmer in tone.
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Old 12-13-2005, 02:22 PM   #3 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graymalkin
The original BSG series in 1978 was a Star Wars rip-off and complete hooey.

The current series is far superior but much grimmer in tone.


Hey, I liked the original BSG. I didn't even know of Star Wars back then

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Old 12-13-2005, 02:22 PM   #4 (Print)
Man In Black
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Yeah



That guy on the left looks like that guy from Cheers. Or an older Scotty from Star Trek.
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Old 12-13-2005, 02:25 PM   #5 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Man In Black
Yeah



That guy on the left looks like that guy from Cheers. Or an older Scotty from Star Trek.


Apparently they wanted a John Ratzenberger look alike to play a secondary part so they could rip off the Empire Strikes Back.


I know ESB was later.

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Old 12-13-2005, 02:26 PM   #6 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Man In Black
I know BSG is thought of as a really good sci fi show, but which one are they referring to? Are they all good, or just certain series?

I know there was the 1978 original series, and then theres the current series airing on SciFi.

I just got BSG Season 2 and am watching it.

BTW, in episode one of Season 2, right at the beginning, that older woman who is in the brig looks like the actor that plays that woman on one of those soaps, As The World Turns or Guiding Light, I forget which. is it?


Your talking about the new series, right? That's Mary McDonnell. I think she was on some soap. I remember her from Dances with Wolves. She played Stands with a Fist.
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Old 12-13-2005, 02:36 PM   #7 (Print)
Redux
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Man In Black
I know BSG is thought of as a really good sci fi show, but which one are they referring to? Are they all good, or just certain series?

I know there was the 1978 original series, and then theres the current series airing on SciFi.


The 1978 original is thought by many to be delightfully cheesey. There was an immediate and even shorter-lived sequel that was no fun at all and I don't believe anyone but the actors' mothers have ever seen it. And then there is the current series that began as a miniseries in 2003 and that is the one that is highly-regarded.
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Old 12-13-2005, 02:53 PM   #8 (Print)
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don't be dissin' the original Battlestar Galactica. I liked that show. Still do.

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Old 12-13-2005, 03:18 PM   #9 (Print)
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I liked the original. It was no more cheesy than a lot of other shows in the 70s, IMO.

The follow-up, Galactica 1980, was awful. Only the final episode, "The Return of Starbuck", is even close to watchable.
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Old 12-13-2005, 03:34 PM   #10 (Print)
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One comment on the original BSG: My understanding is that it had the highest budget ever afforded to a TV series (up to that time, of course) and that a huge portion of that budget was for the effects. Which, you have to admit, were first rate (again, for the day).
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Old 12-13-2005, 03:45 PM   #11 (Print)
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In fact, Battlestar pulled higher ratings in it's time slot than any show previous, including Mork and Mindy, but the then-unheard-of $1million/episode was too high. That's why they replaced it with the cheaper-to-make "Galactica 1980", where most of the episode would occur on Earth.

Another thing to keep in mind was that it was originally a mini-series, with 7 hours of plot. They expanded it to a full series at the last minute and they had a bunch of fill-in episodes. The 7 hours of original story are VERY good, the fill in episodes vary wildly (and even include a remake of "Shane"!).
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Old 12-13-2005, 04:34 PM   #12 (Print)
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Speaking of BSG, watched the first two episodes of Season 2.

Those Cylons are pretty awesome, with scissor hands and guns mounted on their knuckles and what not. Too bad they are on the wrong side
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Old 12-13-2005, 04:46 PM   #13 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Man In Black





Athena was HAWT!!


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Old 12-13-2005, 04:47 PM   #14 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Man In Black
Speaking of BSG, watched the first two episodes of Season 2.


While season 2 is good, I think you would really enjoy season one and the two part miniseries; especially if this your first experience with any BSG show(definitely the mini-series).
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Old 12-13-2005, 04:49 PM   #15 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsmeeker
Athena was HAWT!!



ALL the women in the original BSG were goddesses - hence their names
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Old 12-14-2005, 01:14 AM   #16 (Print)
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Ya know, I never got the whole "BSG was just a rip-off of Star Wars" thing. Is it just because both were space-adventures? I don't see much else to make it seem like one's a rip-off of the other.

BSG - Small tribe of humans fleeing the enemy and trying to find a mythical ancient home.
SW - Small band of rebels trying to overthrow evil empire.

BSG - Bad guys are robots intent on exterminating all human life.
SW - Bad guys are an evil government trying to squash rebellion.

BSG - Main bad guy is a human who turned against humanity in a quest for power.
SW - Main bad guy is a half machine with mystical abilities.

BSG - Main good guy is a rogueish military pilot.
SW - Main good guy is a farm-boy who turns out to have mystical abilities of his own.

BSG - Good guys draw inspiration from a strong military commander.
SW - Good guy draws inspiration from the ghost of a guy he'd just met a few days before who was teaching him magic.

I just don't get it... Is it because Star Wars came first and Star Trek was between it's short-lived show and it's movies and they just needed somebody to argue with regarding superiority?
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Old 12-14-2005, 01:22 AM   #17 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graymalkin

The current series is far superior but much grimmer in tone.


You aint kiddin.
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Old 12-14-2005, 01:34 AM   #18 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeanMeScot
Your talking about the new series, right? That's Mary McDonnell. I think she was on some soap. I remember her from Dances with Wolves. She played Stands with a Fist.


Did some checking, because it was driving me nutty. She has the same facial mannerisms and speaking mannerisms as the soap opera person, so I had to check. Turns out they arent the same. I was thinking of Susan Flannerly (Stephanie Forrester) from The Bold & The Beautiful. If youve watched the show you know what I mean about them acting so similar.

Mary McDonnel-BSG



Susan Flannerly, B&TB
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Old 12-14-2005, 01:36 AM   #19 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tangent
Ya know, I never got the whole "BSG was just a rip-off of Star Wars" thing. Is it just because both were space-adventures? I don't see much else to make it seem like one's a rip-off of the other.

BSG - Small tribe of humans fleeing the enemy and trying to find a mythical ancient home.
SW - Small band of rebels trying to overthrow evil empire.

BSG - Bad guys are robots intent on exterminating all human life.
SW - Bad guys are an evil government trying to squash rebellion.

BSG - Main bad guy is a human who turned against humanity in a quest for power.
SW - Main bad guy is a half machine with mystical abilities.

BSG - Main good guy is a rogueish military pilot.
SW - Main good guy is a farm-boy who turns out to have mystical abilities of his own.

BSG - Good guys draw inspiration from a strong military commander.
SW - Good guy draws inspiration from the ghost of a guy he'd just met a few days before who was teaching him magic.

I just don't get it... Is it because Star Wars came first and Star Trek was between it's short-lived show and it's movies and they just needed somebody to argue with regarding superiority?
Two words: Space battles.

No, seriously, I don't think the similarities lie in story structure, it's more the look an feel of the special effects, costumes, etc. The battle scenes in BSG definitely drew some inspiration from Star Wars. The costumes in BSG seem also to be vaguely reminiscent of Star Wars. I could see Han Solo on BSG; I bet that's who Starbuck is based on. The cylons remind people of stormtroopers. The good-guy fighters are red and white, similar in shape to the x-wing; the bad guys are gray, like tie-fighters.

I agree with you BTW, they where both good IMO. And good stuff inspires other good stuff all the time. I'm just saying I can definitely see the parallels and see how someone could twist that into saying BSG "ripped-off" Star Wars.
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Old 12-14-2005, 02:20 AM   #20 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tangent
Is it because Star Wars came first and Star Trek was between?
I certainly can't argue with your sequencing of Wars & Trek; there was such a gap from the 1960s Star Trek that you can take the position it was a reset/start all over again and Star Wars was first of the new overblown Space Opera phase.

However, _development_ of the first Star Trek Movie preceeded Wars, was pretty much continuous in the interim (from about 4-5 years out from the series). Talk about scripts/stories/casting and even script fragments floating around. Serious pre-production of the first Star Trek movie began prior to that of Star Wars. Though that is a matter of semantics to some extent and clearly there was a procrastination period during Star Trek pre-production that became occupied by Star Wars (and I wouldn't quarrel with the notion that Star Wars actually _caused_ that gap).

I guess my reaction to that sequencing is that, while the Star Wars movie was first, there probably would not have _been_ a Star Wars movie without Trek, while the Star Trek movie would have come out even had there never been a Star Wars (and would probably have been a lot better than it turned out to be). In any case, BG followed both and was driven by them and as you surmise that accounts for some lack of respect. But mainly it was not respected because it was not well done (though a lot more fun than Trek I).
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Old 12-14-2005, 04:36 AM   #21 (Print)
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Actually, Trek wasn't being considered for a movie until Star Wars came out. It was being considered for a new series. I believe 12 episodes were already plotted, one of which ("The Child") was later turned into a Star Trek: The Next Generation episode.

The success of Star Wars caused Paramount to reconfigure the thing as a movie.

As for the similarity of the space scenes between Star Wars and Battlestar, considering BSG was the brainchild of John Dykstra, who had done the special effects for Star Wars (and invented the Dykstraflex camera system in the process), it's not surprising they are similar.

I was one of those who thought, from the previews, that it was going to be a Star Wars ripoff. But once the pilot aired and I was able to watch it, that impression was washed away and I was a fan.
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Old 12-14-2005, 10:24 AM   #22 (Print)
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Ereth is right. The new series was called "Star Trek Phase II" and was supposed to launch a new Paramount television network (much as "Voyager" did for UPN 20 years later). At one time, I had a book about the making of "Phase II", but I have no idea where it is now.

You can read more about it here: http://www.memory-alpha.org/en/inde..._Trek:_Phase_II
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Old 12-14-2005, 03:18 PM   #23 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ereth
Actually, Trek wasn't being considered for a movie until Star Wars came out.


Actually, that is incorrect.

Trek was being considered for a movie beginning just a few years after the series ended. That's what Roddenberry and some original cast members said _at the time_; I'm not relying on accounts of many years later. One script (or at least treatment) I heard Shatner talk about, at the time, had some elements of what eventually became Trek V.

Subsequently, for a period of time a new TV series was considered, actually more than one concept for a series (I think even including a version of the later more-developed "Star Fleet Academy" concept but my memory is not clear about that), but serious work on a Trek movie definitely pre-dated all that, and had picked up again prior to the release of Star Wars. This was during the "procrastination" period I refered to.

Believe what you want (and there are a variety of accounts from years later to choose from). I'm just wanted a report of the accurate sequencing to exist here in the thread: serious work on a Star Trek movie pre-dated Star Wars.
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Old 12-14-2005, 05:35 PM   #24 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ereth
Another thing to keep in mind was that it was originally a mini-series, with 7 hours of plot. They expanded it to a full series at the last minute and they had a bunch of fill-in episodes. The 7 hours of original story are VERY good, the fill in episodes vary wildly (and even include a remake of "Shane"!).


There's a reason for that.
The series was originally intended to be more adult in nature.
During production, the edict came down from the network that show had to be more "family oriented" and more "kid friendly".
Which is why we got things like "Muffit the daggit" and instead of the grim reality of life on the run after your civilization was destroyed, we got "Oh Caprica was destroyed but let's go play Triad and party on the Rising Star".
(And don't get me started with Boxey living on the Galactica)

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Old 12-14-2005, 06:11 PM   #25 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JYoung
There's a reason for that.
The series was originally intended to be more adult in nature.
During production, the edict came down from the network that show had to be more "family oriented" and more "kid friendly".
Which is why we got things like "Muffit the daggit" and instead of the grim reality of life on the run after your civilization was destroyed, we got "Oh Caprica was destroyed but let's go play Triad and party on the Rising Star".
(And don't get me started with Boxey living on the Galactica)



aren't some of those elements still in the NEW BSG?

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Old 12-14-2005, 06:46 PM   #26 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsmeeker
aren't some of those elements still in the NEW BSG?



Although I've only seen the NBC version of the miniseries and the episode 33, my understanding is no (I have tried to avoid spoilers, thank you very much. DVD set came from DDD last week).

I'm pretty sure that the original wouldn't have had the courage to do the scene where Roslin leaves behind the ships that don't have hyperdrive though.

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Old 12-14-2005, 08:47 PM   #27 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redux
Actually, that is incorrect.

Trek was being considered for a movie beginning just a few years after the series ended. That's what Roddenberry and some original cast members said _at the time_; I'm not relying on accounts of many years later. One script (or at least treatment) I heard Shatner talk about, at the time, had some elements of what eventually became Trek V.

Subsequently, for a period of time a new TV series was considered, actually more than one concept for a series (I think even including a version of the later more-developed "Star Fleet Academy" concept but my memory is not clear about that), but serious work on a Trek movie definitely pre-dated all that, and had picked up again prior to the release of Star Wars. This was during the "procrastination" period I refered to.

Believe what you want (and there are a variety of accounts from years later to choose from). I'm just wanted a report of the accurate sequencing to exist here in the thread: serious work on a Star Trek movie pre-dated Star Wars.


So what? Who outside the production team would have any knowledge? What effect would that have? As you mentioned, there was talk about a movie since Star Trek was on TV; you think the success of Star Wars had no impact on when/what/how Star Trek became a movie? Do you think it would have had any success before Star Wars?

So, Fox has the hugest blockbuster in history. Every other studio wants to get on the Sci-Fi bandwagon. Paramount has this "Star Trek" that's been bouncing around in development since it was a TV show. You don't think Star Wars lit a fire under Paramount to pump out Star Trek (now would be a good time for the phrase, "haste makes waste")?

I guess I don't understand what the point of your observation is. It's like saying, "Elisha Gray and Antonio Meucci both invented the telephone independent of Alexander Graham Bell." That's true, but so what?
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Old 12-14-2005, 10:09 PM   #28 (Print)
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Sci-Fi is airing eight hours of the original BSG tomorrow from 8:00 AM - 4:00 PM Eastern time. Included are
  • The three-part pilot (also know as "Saga of a Star World")
  • The Living Legend (two-parter guest-starring Lloyd Bridges)
  • War of the Gods (two-parter)
  • Take the Celestra
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Old 12-14-2005, 10:44 PM   #29 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ereth
Another thing to keep in mind was that it was originally a mini-series, with 7 hours of plot. They expanded it to a full series at the last minute and they had a bunch of fill-in episodes. The 7 hours of original story are VERY good, the fill in episodes vary wildly (and even include a remake of "Shane"!).
What are the episode titles of the 7 hours of original story?
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Old 12-14-2005, 11:07 PM   #30 (Print)
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Pa Cartwright in space!
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