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Old 09-07-2004, 02:54 PM   #91 (Print)
DougF
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Quote:
Originally posted by btwyx
My TiVo has optical out, but I doubt DirecTV would ever allow this on their boxes. They're going to want to sell me a PPV movie instead.


Yeah, same here. But, with DirecTV leaving the USB ports un-enabled...

Of course, they could strike up a deal to deliver the flicks via the satellite, but I don't see that happening.
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Old 09-07-2004, 02:55 PM   #92 (Print)
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You know that I'm a HUGE fan of DD/DTS and Original Aspect Ratio, but there are some times when I just want to SEE a film, to see if it's any good, where I will put up with even a Pan and Scan version with no Dolby.

I watched "Chicago" that way on one of the movie channels and learned I liked it so much I went out and bought the DVD to get the full experience.

I recently turned on "Starz on Demand" and everything they send is 4:3 and none of it is Dolby, but still I can see movies and discover if I liked them, for practically no cost.

I could see using the Netflix/Tivo thing that way. I would never get "The Lord of the Rings" or "Star Wars" through it, but "Hollywood Homicide"? Sure, why not?
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Old 09-07-2004, 02:59 PM   #93 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dan203
This is a partnership agreement, not a feature announcement. TiVo may have done some of the coding before the deal was finalized

Didn't TiVo show a Demo at CES 2 years ago about downloading HBO content on a PPV basis? And what about Real? Unless they're starting over from scratch (or Strangeberry), it'd seem they'd have the code for downloading protected content from the internet and onto a TiVo already.

Even so, it seems like lately it's several months from official announcements until the time the feature is ready.
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Old 09-07-2004, 03:06 PM   #94 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ereth
You know that I'm a HUGE fan of DD/DTS and Original Aspect Ratio, but there are some times when I just want to SEE a film, to see if it's any good, where I will put up with even a Pan and Scan version with no Dolby.

I watched "Chicago" that way on one of the movie channels and learned I liked it so much I went out and bought the DVD to get the full experience.

I recently turned on "Starz on Demand" and everything they send is 4:3 and none of it is Dolby, but still I can see movies and discover if I liked them, for practically no cost.

I could see using the Netflix/Tivo thing that way. I would never get "The Lord of the Rings" or "Star Wars" through it, but "Hollywood Homicide"? Sure, why not?


That's how I think the majority of the movie renting crowd feels. I think it will go over really well. It just won't be for me.
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Old 09-07-2004, 04:12 PM   #95 (Print)
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The Tivo - Netflix connection will only work if it has 5.1 sound and DVD quality picture. I've got Comcast HD DVR and have kept Netflix because of their huge selection and DVD quality. But, I have been recording and watching more and more HD. There is only so much time available and I am not going to pay to watch lower quality programming.
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Old 09-07-2004, 04:24 PM   #96 (Print)
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Must have DD 5.1 for me...

I have to agree with those about the DTS or DD5.1. The only reason I don't use my Tivo, is because of HD and the 5.1 surround sound. My tivo is kind of like backup for when I can't watch it at the quality I want to. With movies, it would be the same thing. If I could rent the DVD and get DVD quality with 5.1, I'd choose that over watching it on the TV, even if it means I have to wait. I'm not one to watch a movie multiple times, I just want to watch it right the first time and savor it. Just my thoughts...

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Old 09-07-2004, 05:07 PM   #97 (Print)
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Like others have mentioned many times above, the Toshiba DVD/TiVo and Pioneer DVD-RW/TiVo units have both Progressive Scan Output and and Digital Audio Output. (I'm assuming the Humax will also) Which means by the time this feature hits the market there will be at least a half dozen TiVos, from 3 different manufacturers, that are capable of producing true DVD quality output. So those of you who think those things are important will have options.

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Old 09-07-2004, 06:34 PM   #98 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by cwoody222
For me too.

It's a disposable movie. It doesn't need to be perfect. Just watchable. Then delete. If I want a better copy to keep, I'll buy one.


Exactly. This is what I love about the cable company's PVR. I can throw 40 movies on there and then watch them at my leisure. TiVo offering that in combination with my Netflix account is fantastic news if it happens.
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Old 09-07-2004, 07:00 PM   #99 (Print)
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It seems to me that there will be an option in your netflix account to send content to your tivo, instead of mail.

Just like you can purchase computer software sometimes by either downloading it, or having it mailed to you.

The way it's worded, it seems like there may not be an extra fee, just a different way to get them.

Wouldn't netflix save money on two way postage?

I'm wondering if you will also be able to go to your tivo and select what you want.

I know a lot of people are complaining about no 5.1, but does 5.1 really matter on most movies. Do you need to listen to Office Space or similar movies in 5.1?

As for the speed, it will be faster then it would be to get anything sent to you from netflix by a longshot, so speed really shouldn't be that much of a factor.

I don't think it would be that hard to setup a queue, where you have a limit of X items in your Tivo Netflix folder, and deleting one will trigger another one to start downloading.

I'm hoping the amount of time you can keep a movie would adhere to the same restrictions as netflix has, not any of these new macrovision plans.

From what I gather, Netflix lets you keep 3 or 5 at a time, and for everyone you send back, you get another from your queue in it's place. Could you theoretically keep 2 for 6 months, and then only be able to get 3, or do they have a time limit?

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Old 09-07-2004, 07:12 PM   #100 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by smak
Wouldn't netflix save money on two way postage?


They would save money on postage AND on buying/producing the physical disks. However bandwidth isn't free, so it would probably be a wash. The major advantage would be inventory control. With the TiVo service they can have a single digital copy and feed it to thousands of customers at once, instead of having to try to maintain an inventory of disks that adhere to the current demand.

Quote:
Originally posted by smak
I'm wondering if you will also be able to go to your tivo and select what you want.


No one knows for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that the selections are still made online and the TiVo simply get's fed whatever movie is next in your online que.

Dan

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Old 09-07-2004, 08:30 PM   #101 (Print)
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My guess..... it is just a brand name that Tivo wants to attach to new VOD services. Those of you with non-DirecTV Tivo will now have an option for a StarzVOD like on D* (but called NetflixVOD). This benefits both Netflix (brand name recognition) and Tivo (shared cost). Could be $12 per month or $3 per movie....

Series 2 DirecTivos already have 5.1, but I wonder if we'll see this service. That being said, my DVD player scales video up to 1080i (HD quality) so I would never make us of the service. It's worth it for me to wait for the DVD to come in the mail.
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Old 09-07-2004, 10:02 PM   #102 (Print)
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What about the DTV HD TIVO??

I haven't seen anyone say anything about this rumor and the HD TIVO, I would think other than the possible space limitations it would work. The HD TIVO has all the functionallity of a DVD player (HD/DD) the only thing is the delivery method for the DTV HD TiVo. I think they had this idea in mind when they designed this unit, I hope so cause I shelled out nearly a grand for the pig! I would be very upset if I needed to upgrade in order to participate in the Netflix service, especially since I am already a subcriber to both TiVO and Netflix!!! Bring it on, I want the beta!!!

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Old 09-07-2004, 11:12 PM   #103 (Print)
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http://business.bostonherald.com/te...articleid=43236

"But not so fast. TiVo and Netflix were vague yesterday. They said such an alliance might make sense in the future, but there's no partnership in place, and that TiVo won't offer any movie-download service for at least a year. "
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Old 09-08-2004, 02:53 AM   #104 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dan203
USB 1.1 and 802.11b are both faster then even the highest bandwidth broadband connections, so I don't think the two quite go hand in hand. However I think if TiVo is going to enable USB 2.0 it will be when TiVoToGo is released. If they don't do it at that time I wouldn't expect it at all.

Dan
Yes, but transferring shows and movies within one's own LAN is still neutered by the USB monstrosity. More I-told-you-so fodder for us Ethernet holdouts. The USB dongles are better than nothing, but an actual Ethernet port would have avoided a lot of problems and annoyances. Maybe in a future TiVo hardware platform we will finally have this.

As to TiVo and Netflix: this seems like a perfect match. If this joint venture works out and is successful, maybe, possibly, the two companies might merge, somewhere down the line. They seem to share a lot of complementary strengths; Netflix is a "content server" (currently by mail, evenually by internet) and TiVo is a "content client" (that is, the TiVo box itself is). It's a logical client/server relationship.

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Old 09-08-2004, 06:26 AM   #105 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dan203
They would save money on postage AND on buying/producing the physical disks. However bandwidth isn't free, so it would probably be a wash. The major advantage would be inventory control. With the TiVo service they can have a single digital copy and feed it to thousands of customers at once, instead of having to try to maintain an inventory of disks that adhere to the current demand.
this will be a huge savings to them and I bet will more than offset
the bandwidth costs at some number of people using the download service. I bet their business plan shows a good ROI on this.


Quote:

No one knows for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that the selections are still made online and the TiVo simply get's fed whatever movie is next in your online que.
Dan


the sweet spot for me on this would be an extra check box in the queue that designates wether the movie is sent in the mail or downloaded and I still have the 5 at time combined among them.

Last edited by ZeoTiVo : 09-08-2004 at 06:31 AM.
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Old 09-08-2004, 12:16 PM   #106 (Print)
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this service would probably be targeted toward the masses and the masses still don't have high end equipment.

don't expect to see high res video or picture for a long time. once they make money from the masses, then they will come out with a high end version for us afficionados.

just like the hd-tivo took a very long time to come out.

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Old 09-08-2004, 12:44 PM   #107 (Print)
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To me audio and video quality is on the top of my list. Then comes everything else.
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Old 09-08-2004, 01:09 PM   #108 (Print)
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i think the only reason dvd sales took off was the convenience of no rewind and the extras and form factor. i don't think it was the superior sound and video over vhs.

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Old 09-08-2004, 01:13 PM   #109 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by slocko
i think the only reason dvd sales took off was the convenience of no rewind and the extras and form factor. i don't think it was the superior sound and video over vhs.
I wonder if DVDs are educating the consumer about better audio/video quality. Back when VHS was the dominant format, I thought that if the average consumer accepted that crappy quality, what used did they have for HD (or whatever other better video standard was out there). Now they're used to DVD, there seems to be some interest in HD, and better video quality in general.

Edit: or maybe its just the consumer electronics companies wanting to shift more, and more profitable, merchandise.

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Old 09-08-2004, 02:42 PM   #110 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by topcats69
My main issue is NO DD 5.1 would suck..


not to be repetitive- but since people keep saying this I'll say it again again-

all the combination Tivo DVD players and recorders have digital audio and component outputs. So if thats important to you you have a choice.

I dont know the details as i was busy waiting for my HDirectivo at the time but i think i read that toshiba was selling their player unit with tivo for $199 last spring so the price isnt all that out of hand to get one box that does both and allows this new download of movies. THe Pioneer units even have forudja chips if you want top end.

WHo knows maybe the next generation DVD Tivo units have HDMI....
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Old 09-08-2004, 03:18 PM   #111 (Print)
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My concerns (the same as some that have been voiced here already):

1. 5.1/Dolby Digital/DTS sound. Sorry, I've grown used to it and don't want to give it up. Unless TiVo is planning on new versions of it's units that include the proper hookups so that it can connect to the receiver.

2. How much space would it take up on the hard disk? Currently, I only have one unit, and it is a 40-hour one. Of course, this could be on the level of my first concern if TiVo introduces new units with a USB or firewire link so that we can add hard disks without hacking open our units.

3. Will there be extras? That's also a major factor with DVDs. I like extras, and don't want to give them up.

I hope these are addressed.
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Old 09-08-2004, 04:12 PM   #112 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Leo Valiant
http://business.bostonherald.com/te...articleid=43236

"But not so fast. TiVo and Netflix were vague yesterday. They said such an alliance might make sense in the future, but there's no partnership in place, and that TiVo won't offer any movie-download service for at least a year. "


Why hasn't anybody commented on this information? Did everyone breeze by it? Were we all still dreaming about what we needed the service to be? An IMDB story now says the same thing.

From IMDB:
"Spokespersons for Netflix and TiVo dismissed a Newsweek report Tuesday that the two companies were planning a joint venture that would essentially allow Netflix subscribers to download movies onto their TiVo recorders rather than receive them through the mail. Bloomberg News quoted a TiVo spokeswoman as saying that such a service would not be offered for at least a year. Nevertheless shares in both companies soared on the magazine's report, Netflix rising 7.3 percent to $15.41; TiVo, nearly 15 percent to $5.08."

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Old 09-08-2004, 04:23 PM   #113 (Print)
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I can't help but hold out hope that TiVo will utilize the SECOND USB port on the S2's for a USB ----> SPDIF adapter . Then at least the audio portion would surely deliver on a downloaded movie.

In case you haven't seen, there are plenty of these devices on the market. Maybe only a driver would need to be written? Anyone with a more in-depth knowledge of TiVo's guts care to comment?

Turtle Beach Adapter
Edirol UA-1X
M-Audio Audiophile
TechUS

Plus a few that I can't find links for at the moment.

The point is that plenty of these devices do exist, and are not very expensive. Why would they give us two usb ports? Is it cheaper to buy a two module usb component? Do they not come in single versions? I'm not claiming to have any extensive knowledge in this area.....I'm simply raising a few questions....
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Old 09-08-2004, 04:58 PM   #114 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by gtrogue
Why hasn't anybody commented on this information? Did everyone breeze by it? Were we all still dreaming about what we needed the service to be? An IMDB story now says the same thing.

From IMDB:
"Spokespersons for Netflix and TiVo dismissed a Newsweek report Tuesday that the two companies were planning a joint venture that would essentially allow Netflix subscribers to download movies onto their TiVo recorders rather than receive them through the mail. Bloomberg News quoted a TiVo spokeswoman as saying that such a service would not be offered for at least a year. Nevertheless shares in both companies soared on the magazine's report, Netflix rising 7.3 percent to $15.41; TiVo, nearly 15 percent to $5.08."



it was the same thing with DirectTV using NDS - lots of rumors - then people reporting it as fact but no confirming source for it - then it was officially announced. The first story linked also had both companies saying they would not comment on what they regarded as rumor. few think we would see this in 2004, many, myself included , hope to see it first half of 2005 - though at first it may not be feature movies but maybe old TV shows and short films.
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Old 09-08-2004, 05:21 PM   #115 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by AirShark
I can't help but hold out hope that TiVo will utilize the SECOND USB port on the S2's for a USB ----> SPDIF adapter . Then at least the audio portion would surely deliver on a downloaded movie.

In case you haven't seen, there are plenty of these devices on the market. Maybe only a driver would need to be written? Anyone with a more in-depth knowledge of TiVo's guts care to comment?
There is a Linux USB audio driver of some description that works, and the USB audio standard allows for the transport of multichannel audio (including 5.1).

The next question is how standard the devices are, in the past they've been a bit flaky, and the newer cheap ones tend to need a download driver for them to start working. It might be possible, but it'd take some effort. TiVo'd have to answer the question of whether it'd be worth it to them.

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Old 09-08-2004, 05:38 PM   #116 (Print)
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TiVo could always partner with someone like they did with the Ethernet/Wireless adapters. That way they would have at least one manufacture making devices that they knew worked.

The funny thing is the Pioneer unit, which already has digital audio output, only has one USB port. All the standalone TiVos without digital audio output have two. I wonder if this was part of their plan from the beginning?

Dan

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Old 09-08-2004, 05:48 PM   #117 (Print)
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Quote:
[i] ....The funny thing is the Pioneer unit, which already has digital audio output, only has one USB port. All the standalone TiVos without digital audio output have two. I wonder if this was part of their plan from the beginning?

Dan [/B]


Could you explain what you mean by the statement above?
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Old 09-08-2004, 05:56 PM   #118 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dan203
The funny thing is the Pioneer unit, which already has digital audio output, only has one USB port. All the standalone TiVos without digital audio output have two. I wonder if this was part of their plan from the beginning?


Maybe it's the same strategy as Microsoft uses with the XBOX....They already lose money on the box. So, instead of building in hi-def and optical outputs, you have to buy the adapter after the fact. The majority won't use them, saving you money, but there will still be a group who want this feature, so you charge them to buy an adapter later.

I don't know about component video output, especially since sending you a movie in this format would be considerably larger, but the 5.1DD audio output seems like a definate viable option while not adding much to the downloaded file size.

That is indeed a curious choice by TiVo to put a different amount of USB ports on different units. I'm not holding my breath, but maybe we've stumbled onto a foreshadowing hint of what's to come? ;-)

I for one am reasonably satisfied with my picture quality...but 5.1 audio.....I just don't think I would enjoy frequently watching new movies in regular stereo when instead I could just wait my current 1 day to recieve the DVD in the mail.
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Old 09-08-2004, 05:59 PM   #119 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by DCIFRTHS
Could you explain what you mean by the statement above?


He means that the Pioneer-branded units have built-in support for surround sound. However, they only have one USB port (for a network adapter).

The standalone TiVo-company branded units have only built in stereo audio outputs. However, they have TWO usb ports built in to the unit. One is for a network adapter.....the other one is a mystery. We are brainstorming that that extra USB port could be used to pump surround sound out of the unit from a downloaded Netflix movie.
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Old 09-08-2004, 06:01 PM   #120 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally posted by MichaelK

all the combination Tivo DVD players and recorders have digital audio and component outputs. So if thats important to you you have a choice.

....



But I don't want another DVD player!!!!! And you can't upgrade HD in a DVD combo. And I don't like to buy combo player. what happens if the DVD dies and not the Tivo side or the other way around I'm then Screwed.

I like my HTIBox but that is one problem with it.
I would much rather have a SA with DD 5.1 out coaxial no to-slink.
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