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Old 03-29-2005, 09:39 AM   #1 (Print)
jdmatl
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No way to OPTOUT of AD Popup!

I remember being told there would be a method to "opt-out". I have purchased my last tivo if there is no "opt-out" option.

Bye-bye tivo.

Whatever the cable company offeres, i will get. If it is a stripped down Tivo, no problem.

I just hope that this info is incorrect and "opt-out" is an "option.


http://news.com.com/TiVo+tests+pop-...44197&subj=news


===
The tools will be tested only on Series2 TiVo owners, but once completed could be applied to Series 1 and DirecTiVo customers. Subscribers can't opt out of the feature, but they can ignore the tags.

"Our goal is in no way to interfere with the TiVo experience," TiVo spokesman David Shane said.

Some viewers initially experienced technical problems with the advertising tag, according to Web postings, which TiVo confirmed and said only affected a small group of those involved in the test.
==========
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Old 03-29-2005, 09:46 AM   #2 (Print)
PanamaGixxer
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Damn - I did not think it was that bad. Something like this will not be the reason I leave TIVO. I have 4 and love all of them. The pixels after the upgrade are much more worse than the add. If they were a little smaller or not directly in the middle of the screen, I would not care at all.

Also, if this is some revenue that keeps TIVO alive for many more moons - good for them. It scares me everytime I see a post about TIVO going bankrupt!

Just my 2 cents!
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Old 03-29-2005, 09:47 AM   #3 (Print)
hawk4hire
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Oh that "small group" must be other 1%'ers. lol Why is it a "glitch" like this only happens to a "small group" of users.
Kind of like UFO's they only appear to a small group of people - lol
Seriously though - was that "small group of those involved in the test" asked if they wanted to be involved? Guess we are all beta testers now...
jmho
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Old 03-29-2005, 09:48 AM   #4 (Print)
netposer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdmatl
I remember being told there would be a method to "opt-out". I have purchased my last tivo if there is no "opt-out" option.

Bye-bye tivo.

Whatever the cable company offeres, i will get. If it is a stripped down Tivo, no problem.

I just hope that this info is incorrect and "opt-out" is an "option.


http://news.com.com/TiVo+tests+pop-...44197&subj=news


===
The tools will be tested only on Series2 TiVo owners, but once completed could be applied to Series 1 and DirecTiVo customers. Subscribers can't opt out of the feature, but they can ignore the tags.

"Our goal is in no way to interfere with the TiVo experience," TiVo spokesman David Shane said.

Some viewers initially experienced technical problems with the advertising tag, according to Web postings, which TiVo confirmed and said only affected a small group of those involved in the test.
==========


I noticed this quote in the article:

"Our goal is in no way to interfere with the TiVo experience," TiVo spokesman David Shane said.

Does Mr. Shane think we are stupid? What an ass. I'd hate to see what TiVo thinks will interfere with the service.
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Old 03-29-2005, 09:51 AM   #5 (Print)
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So I guess according to Mr. Shane pixels dont interfere with the service, sluggish Tivo's dont interfere with the service, slow menus dont interfere with the service, popup ads dont interfere with the service and silly CSR's who "dont know" about any real issues - dont interfere with the service...
Did I miss any?? lol

jmho

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Old 03-29-2005, 09:52 AM   #6 (Print)
DigitalProperty
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Pop up ads? BAH!

The only reason I got Tivo is to skip over commericals. If they start forcing new ones on me, there is NO REASON for me to continue my subscription.

Nice job screwing up my service, Tivo.
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Old 03-29-2005, 10:08 AM   #7 (Print)
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You guys are a bunch of babies. I am sure they are working on software patches to fix the known bugs (pixels, etc.). The pop-up is only there for a few seconds - easily enough to ignore. Honestly, go somewhere else if you find a better service. I have not heard of anything that matches TIVO yet - but you never know, something may be around the corner.

If you guys did not notice - TIVO is a corporation too - they need to find ways to make money. This is one option that they are looking into. I am sure there will be others. If you are waiting around for free TIVOs, no montly fees, automatic commericial deletion, etc... - go back to fantasy island.
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Old 03-29-2005, 10:08 AM   #8 (Print)
Mamoth
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With this and the fact that TiVo has not come out and said they have a problem with performance, double clicks, etc.. I've pretty much had it.

The TiVo zealots on this forum I'm sure will start a flame fest about how wonderful TiVo is.. but these things are just not addressed and continue to plague the TiVo community as a whole. I have no problem with them generating revenue streams.. and if this is the way to do it.. fine. But at least address and be upfront about the issues that are relavant now. They haven't even admitted there IS a problem. That's just poor CS.

Very sad.

Bye TiVo.

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Old 03-29-2005, 10:22 AM   #9 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PanamaGixxer
You guys are a bunch of babies. I am sure they are working on software patches to fix the known bugs (pixels, etc.). The pop-up is only there for a few seconds - easily enough to ignore. Honestly, go somewhere else if you find a better service. I have not heard of anything that matches TIVO yet - but you never know, something may be around the corner.

If you guys did not notice - TIVO is a corporation too - they need to find ways to make money. This is one option that they are looking into. I am sure there will be others. If you are waiting around for free TIVOs, no montly fees, automatic commericial deletion, etc... - go back to fantasy island.


It's starts out like this then before you know it the FF is gone.

If folks don't speak up about this it will get worse.
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Old 03-29-2005, 10:24 AM   #10 (Print)
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Panama -
Am not am not ... lol
that being said - I paid for the Tivo service - I paid for the ability to FF through commercials..not to have to watch more.
As for the rest - I, as a client, expect the proper and great service I pay for.
When you go to a restaurant and get crappy service do you tip the waiter? Sure you pay for the food - but you are a client of the waiter and expect great service. I wont leave a tip if I get really bad service.
I happen to believe I should get a bargain for my money. And prior to 7.x I was TOTALLY happy with Tivo and their service... and IF they had fixed 7.x in a timely manner - (not waiting 4 months) I might be happy too but this compounds an already frustrating problem.
So if that is being a baby by asking what I pay for - then call me a baby...

jmho

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Old 03-29-2005, 10:25 AM   #11 (Print)
jdmatl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PanamaGixxer
You guys are a bunch of babies. I am sure they are working on software patches to fix the known bugs (pixels, etc.). The pop-up is only there for a few seconds - easily enough to ignore. Honestly, go somewhere else if you find a better service. I have not heard of anything that matches TIVO yet - but you never know, something may be around the corner.

If you guys did not notice - TIVO is a corporation too - they need to find ways to make money. This is one option that they are looking into. I am sure there will be others. If you are waiting around for free TIVOs, no montly fees, automatic commericial deletion, etc... - go back to fantasy island.



I look at Tivo as Satellite Radio. I pay for Sirius cause I want commercial free content and many choices. That choice includes not having ads forced on me.

How would you like it if Itunes started to put commericals into the start and end of every song? Hey, they are a company and need revenue also?

All tivo has to do is give me the option to "opt-out". Make it as complex as you want. Bury it 17 menus deep, required a letter via snail mail..whatever. Just give me the option.

90% of most people won't opt-out. Those hard-core guys like me and many others will. But the 1% they are pissing-off provide over 80% of the support and promote their product.
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Old 03-29-2005, 10:27 AM   #12 (Print)
rainwater
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdmatl
Whatever the cable company offeres, i will get. If it is a stripped down Tivo, no problem.


Cable companies throw ads everywhere in their software. I am not sure what the benefit will be there.
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Old 03-29-2005, 10:38 AM   #13 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainwater
Cable companies throw ads everywhere in their software. I am not sure what the benefit will be there.



I have 2 Dish DVR's (522 and 510) and there are no ads on them. Yes, Dish has channels that promote Dish and let you know about thier services but nothing gets "plastered" on top of my ff's.

And if they did I'd go to DirecTV.

Wow, it's amazing how companies treat their customers when they have competition.
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Old 03-29-2005, 10:48 AM   #14 (Print)
DougF
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Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see what the big deal is.

The TiVo will display an advertisement while you are fast-forwarding. If you want more info, you press thumbs-up or select. If not, you don't do anything.
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Old 03-29-2005, 10:51 AM   #15 (Print)
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Doug - what you are missing is I dont want ads at all - that is WHY I am ff'ing... you know skipping the ads? lol
We know that Tivo can target certain users to get the ads (like they did for this test) so why not create an opt out choice - so you can get the ads and I wont have to be subjected to them - Simple huh??

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Old 03-29-2005, 10:54 AM   #16 (Print)
ZeoTiVo
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well I can only say again - these are not new ads, just a still image representing what the ad you are FFing is about. What is added about that ?


as for taking away FF - that is a more ridiculous statement than they will put yellow stars on every menu turned out to be. With the Yellow stars - TiVo kept them to one ad on one menu - and simply rotates through if they have more than one going at a time. TiVo never moved beyond that for one simple reason - they get that if they put stuff everywhere people will find less value in TiVo service and move on. Less subscriptions and less eyes for the ads. In short simple business common sense will see to it that we do not have yellow starts everywhere and it will also see to it that FF is never turned off.

in short this is still just a picture that pops up over a FFed ad and nothing more.
also it has nothing to do with 7.x version. It is simply an extended use of the ipreview that has been around at least since 4x and most likely is in 3x as well.

I doubt any developer resources are being diverted to this at this time, as it has been in the code for a while and the only bug reported is the tags were placed incorrectly in the broadcast stream to keep the billboard contained in the ad timeframe.
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Old 03-29-2005, 10:54 AM   #17 (Print)
netposer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DougF
Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see what the big deal is.

The TiVo will display an advertisement while you are fast-forwarding. If you want more info, you press thumbs-up or select. If not, you don't do anything.


I see this as a first step. If they can do this you can BET the future will hold more instrusive ads.

If you don't mind ads then why do you ff thru commercials in the first place?

I wonder how folks would feel if TiVo disabled ff during commercials--I see that coming once we let them get away with this.
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Old 03-29-2005, 10:59 AM   #18 (Print)
mmascari
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DougF
Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see what the big deal is.

The TiVo will display an advertisement while you are fast-forwarding. If you want more info, you press thumbs-up or select. If not, you don't do anything.


You missed one little thing, that makes it even more of a non-issue.

The TiVo will display an advertisement while you are fast-forwarding, only over the ad you are fast-forwarding past, without affecting the fast-forward function at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hawk4hire
Doug - what you are missing is I dont want ads at all - that is WHY I am ff'ing... you know skipping the ads? lol
We know that Tivo can target certain users to get the ads (like they did for this test) so why not create an opt out choice - so you can get the ads and I wont have to be subjected to them - Simple huh??


The add is already there, it's part of the broadcast. As I said here, this is simply replacing blurry video with an optimized for high speed image from the same person who created the video being skipped.

If you want to opt out of ads in TV shows, subscribe to premium ad free content. Then there will never be any tags, since there will not be any ads.
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Old 03-29-2005, 11:29 AM   #19 (Print)
DougF
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Quote:
Originally Posted by netposer
I see this as a first step. If they can do this you can BET the future will hold more instrusive ads.

If you don't mind ads then why do you ff thru commercials in the first place?

I wonder how folks would feel if TiVo disabled ff during commercials--I see that coming once we let them get away with this.


If that's how it ends up, then I'll be first in line to cancel.

Until then, I just don't see it as any different than product placement in a movie or TV show.

I'm pretty sure the crew at TiVo knows that if they eliminate FF, they can probably kiss 75% of their customer base good-bye.
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Old 03-29-2005, 11:32 AM   #20 (Print)
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Ok mm and Zeo - those are fair comments/observations...
As long as it's not too long lasting and small and only during that commercial I can live with it... but I would still like to opt out.. lol

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Old 03-29-2005, 11:33 AM   #21 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by netposer
I see this as a first step. If they can do this you can BET the future will hold more instrusive ads.

If you don't mind ads then why do you ff thru commercials in the first place?

I wonder how folks would feel if TiVo disabled ff during commercials--I see that coming once we let them get away with this.



What's that sound?? Listen, don't you hear it?? Shhhhhh, there. Can't you hear that? I tell you there are black helicopters right over our head. There goes one now. You can't hear that??

I saw my first "ad" last night. No big deal to me. It was mentioned in another post that some people would pay more if they could opt-out of these ads. That might be a cool idea, the people that want to opt out could pay more and those of us that don't care could pay less. Yea, I like that idea. Although I have life time on all my units, but you get my drift.

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Old 03-29-2005, 11:39 AM   #22 (Print)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawk4hire
Ok mm and Zeo - those are fair comments/observations...
As long as it's not too long lasting and small and only during that commercial I can live with it... but I would still like to opt out.. lol


For all I care, it can take up the entire screen. The advertiser bought the that segment of video. If they only want to show me a static image instead of the blurry video, that's fine with me. They could actually do this today without TiVo's help, just show a static image instead of a normal commercial video. Probably be boring for regular watchers, but definitely cheaper to produce.

Either way, when the image is gone, I'll know the commercial is over. That should be much easier to tell than trying to distinguish between blurry video that is the commercial and blurry video that is the content.

This is simply the start of redefining the 30 second spot into the 3 (or however long it takes you to fast forward already) second spot.
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Old 03-29-2005, 11:56 AM   #23 (Print)
ZeoTiVo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawk4hire
Doug - what you are missing is I dont want ads at all - that is WHY I am ff'ing... you know skipping the ads? lol
We know that Tivo can target certain users to get the ads (like they did for this test) so why not create an opt out choice - so you can get the ads and I wont have to be subjected to them - Simple huh??

hawk


actually I am not FFing to skip the ads, sometimes I even stop on things like Movie trailers and watch them , I FF to get back to the story I am watching quicker. As long as I can do that they can put up the singing/dancing hampsters web page for all I care. (ok maybe that would be too much to take)
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Old 03-29-2005, 12:59 PM   #24 (Print)
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Wow, people are so mad about the popups that the moderator had to close the main thread because it got out of hand! They are going to put it back up after dousing the flames, LOL...
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Old 03-29-2005, 01:13 PM   #25 (Print)
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Lol Zeo - dont discriminate against hamsters - if they pay the fee to Tivo they can have their 2 seconds of fame... lol
My concern is what are the perimeters (sp) - I ff through a lot of commercials because I dont want my 4 yr old watching Viagra or PMS or beer commercials. If I think its inapprorpiate then I ff through it - that being said as long your comments hold true re: 30 sec skip I will be ok - I just dont want a big Viagra pill thrown up on the screen or something worse.
Is it only going to be done after 8? Is it only going to be done on certain shows or is any show any time fair game?
I am not pushing for an answer but as a parent I would like to know how to prep for it. All I know is that when the Disney movie Finding Nemo came out my son would scream and cry because he was terrified of the shark. I had to ff quick - I dont want a shark that I was ff'ing through to be placed on the screen.
I hope that makes sense - I am not trying to complain as much as a client of Tivo I would like to know what is going on.

jmho
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Old 03-29-2005, 01:21 PM   #26 (Print)
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Why not just 30-sec skip? Isn't that all of the FF w/o the ads?
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Old 03-29-2005, 01:25 PM   #27 (Print)
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umm cause I'm a dumb butt and hadnt implimented it yet... lol But I will now.
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Old 03-29-2005, 01:29 PM   #28 (Print)
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Can anyone explain what happens with these popups when 30s skip is utilized? Let's see, 6 quick 30s skip button presses to get through a 3 minute commercial doesn't give whole a lot of time for a popup. For those who would opt out, would you be willing to pay more in your subscription fee?

And to those who'll leave TiVo for the cable company DVR. Don't think you'll be insulated from popups there.

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Old 03-29-2005, 01:37 PM   #29 (Print)
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Sure a buck more? Tivo cant be getting that much revenue from these ads verses how much ill will they are causing from customers.
Things cant always be measured in $$$ - sometimes the customer is right. And sometimes you make a decision based on what is best for the customer - because if they are happy you will get more customers. Bojangles restaurant once said
"if you make a bad biscuit then that customer will tell 8 people and you will lose biz - but if you make a good one that customer will tell 8 people and you will gain." Which is best keep customers happy or a few advertisers.
I saw that a lot of people said they wouldnt mind the ad - but no one said yes I want them (except Zeo - lol).
Anyway - as I see it - to Tivo its all about the $$$ and not about the customers. And if they change their minds then I will be glad to be wrong. And sure you can say Tivo is a corp accountable to shareholders - but at the same time - if you drive off your customer base isnt that a breach of their fiduciary duty to the shareholder as well? Its a tough choice they are in.. we'll see who wins Tivo - the Advertisers - or the customers..
Maybe we all can win IF Tivo can make the ads REALLY small - but someone earlier said that the size is up to the advertiser. Who knows...
jmho
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Old 03-29-2005, 01:40 PM   #30 (Print)
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I look at Tivo as Satellite Radio. I pay for Sirius cause I want commercial free content and many choices. That choice includes not having ads forced on me.

How would you like it if Itunes started to put commericals into the start and end of every song? Hey, they are a company and need revenue also?


You don't see the difference .
TiVo doesn't directly market or intend itself to be a service that permits or creates a commercial free TV experience, they are a TV recording service, which record content you separately obtain, and permits you to enjoy it in a more flexible manner.

Sirius and iTunes are themseves content providers, which you are subscribing with the expectation of be commercial free.

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